It's about respect.

[rogueslayer452]

It's so interesting to me seeing people who don't understand the concept of nonbinary deciding that just because they don't get it, it means that they can be not only completely rude but also discredit and invalidate anyone who identifies as such, along with other dismissive and ignorant attitudes all because it challenges their limited worldview that they don't want to change.

In elementary school, when we were learning about pronouns during English lessons (in the context of writing and language), it was taught that you used they/them when you either don't know a person's gender or are trying to not reveal someone's gender. This was something that I learned and used quite often ever since, both in writing and when speaking. So when learning more about gender identity, it makes perfect sense to me that someone who doesn't want to identity as of either gender binaries would prefer to use they/them, since I had a pretty good understanding of how it was used in language and, even though that wasn't what we were learning it for, it was just a natural progression of me understanding it being used for gender identity. If you can use they/them in context of not knowing someone's identity or wanting to keep someone anonymous, it shouldn't be hard to continue using those pronouns once you learn that that's how they want to be addressed as.

So please, be respectful of people's gender identities, or any other personal identity they may have.

Comments

[author-by-night.livejournal.com]

Maybe he'll change still, and just needs more conversations. We can only hope.

I agree it's best to to just be respectful. Moreover, I imagine the number of true attention seekers is very low. I don't doubt that it happens, but given how many trans and nonbinary people are assaulted and killed for existing, I really can't imagine it's even remotely common. (I know what you're saying, no worries, just adding onto it. )

Conversely, if you suspect someone is trans or NB, you still have to let them come out. I've known a few people who very much presented as gender fluid, but you know, that's for them to tell. If it's even the case at all. There IS a certain way we view gender that is, in and of itself, problematic and more societal than scientific. A few years ago some family members and I were talking about this, and I was saying how some little boys like "girly" things. As I was saying it, though, I realized... what the hell are girly things? Who decided that a little boy liking dolls was girly? I'm not saying that there isn't certain behavior that tends to be more masculine or feminine, but society has also dictated what kids "should" enjoy, and they pick up on that pretty fast.

(Also, GI Joes are dolls. Just saying.)

[elizalavelle.livejournal.com]

I would also imagine the amount of attention seekers is low. I've known a few who just jump on whatever bandwagon there is to try to get followers online. But I also don't know their truth so maybe when they say they're non binary they mean it as opposed to the last thing they said, or maybe they don't. Either way it hurts me zero to change to they/them pronouns and if they want to change back in a while that's okay too.

Oh yes best not to assume someone is out or insist on pronouns that you think fit them before they're ready. I just figure it's all comfort level. If I can do something that makes someone else more comfortable that's a good thing to do.

Agreed about the way we view gender being problematic. The fact we've gendered toys and jobs etc. as a society is an issue. GI Joes are definitely dolls. I liked making up stories with dolls etc. when I was little but I remember I got Polly Pockets and my brother got Mad Max. Mad Max lived in spooky castles with monsters etc. and I just took his set and combined them both so my little dolls could have better stories. Sometimes Frankenstein was brought to a nice house to learn what a real bed felt like and to be pampered, sometimes Polly went on a proper adventure.

I think society at large is getting a better idea that gender is not so black and white as we thought it was and also that it really doesn't matter. I'm hopeful for future generations getting to let go of the "rules" a bit more.

[elizalavelle.livejournal.com]

I hope coworker will change... but I've got doubt. He's a disenfranchised boomer who has put his anger in the wrong places. It's always someone else's fault that his life didn't go the way he wanted BUT it's not ever the rich or powerful who create systems that ensure the rich get richer, the poor are screwed, and anyone in the middle drifts a little closer to poor each year. That's a complex thing to tackle, especially as he's a Conservative voter (similar to Republicans in the US) and doesn't want to deal with the fact that he is and has been voting against his own interests for years. As long as he thinks someone else is getting hurt more by his vote he'll keep casting it that way.

And dude is from an immigrant family. I'm unsure if he was born in Canada, but his parents weren't. Yet he's super against immigrants now... It's a lot of frustrating.

[author-by-night.livejournal.com]

There are, sadly, immigrants and kids of immigrants who believe their parents came "the right way." And ignore other things. For instance, everyone I know whose parents or grandparents were immigrants will say "(s)he /they never learned English." Yet some of them will also talk about how immigrants should all speak English. It's not typical of non-English speaking immigrants to learn immediately, or maybe at all. It's always been the case that 9/10, the kids end up translating, especially if said immigrants live in areas where everyone speaks the same or a similar language.

[elizalavelle.livejournal.com]

Agreed. I think he's got that kind of belief that his parents did it the right way but he's definitely the type who will be against more recent immigrants because they "take jobs" or "don't assimilate" etc. when heck it's so hard to assimilate. If you dropped me in the middle of China tomorrow it would be extremely difficult for me to figure out the language and the culture and I certainly would be seeking out a group of other immigrants who speak my language and could see that as an adult I may never become totally comfortable with the language.