Seeing red for the holidays...

[rogueslayer452]

++ Learning about Eliza Dushku's sexual harassment claim against Michael Weatherly while her time on Bull is absolutely horrific, especially knowing the shit she's been through already from the industry. Not only was what he did reprehensible and disgusting, but the fact that CBS attempted to blacklist Eliza by showing "proof" that she was the more unstable one by sending in a tape of her using profanity. I'm glad it backfired on them, though, since what they had was actually evidence of the harassment itself thereby backing up Eliza's claims. But still, they gave her hush money to make her go away with this, and that is just so gross regardless. I always wondered why Eliza's character didn't come back, since it was originally announced she would become a regular recurring character and where things left off it made it seem like there would've been more down the line. I guess now we know the real reason. I mean, CBS is the home of shows like Criminal Minds and NCIS, where both have repeatedly treated their actresses horribly, not to mention that they previously passed on the opportunity for a Nancy Drew reboot because it would've been "too female". So, this goes to further demonstrate their attitudes regarding women, and it just makes me even more angry with what they did to Eliza.

Also, I haven't been watching Bull for some time now, initially not out of disinterest but because I was catching up on other stuff and it kind of got put to the side. But knowing this, alongside the knowledge I just learned that Annabelle Attanasio, who played Cable, my favorite character on the show, wasn't going to return for its current third season (and the manner of which they wrote her off is just, ugh, no), it has made me less inclined to bother catching up.

++ Doctor Who won't be returning until early 2020, which has received some mixed reactions from the fandom, alongside that there is going to be a New Years special instead of the regular Christmas special this year. I, personally, don't mind either. We're still getting a special so it doesn't matter if it's specifically a Christmas one or not. As for S12 not premiering until 2020, I can understand people's frustrations. But at the same time, we currently live in a binge-watching culture and have kinda gotten used to waiting for certain shows to return. Doctor Who has risen in popularity in recent years, especially here in the States, and the possibility of interest losing momentum probably won't happen. So, while the wait sucks, I am not at all bothered by it.

++ Speaking of the holidays, Richard Armitage has narrated yet another audiobook, The Christmas Hirelings, which is now available on Audible for free! You're welcome. ❤

Comments

[nemophilist.livejournal.com]

I'm so furious/upset about what happened to Eliza.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I just feel so angry on her behalf. What happened to her was horrible, but I'm glad that she was able to fight back, even if it meant losing a potential recurring secure job. But still, it's a sickening trend with CBS and their treatment of women.

[hamarakissa.livejournal.com]

What happened to Eliza is infuriating >:| I never watched Bull and I now never will.

Agreed about people needing to learn to wait for good things, like Doctor Who. I get that 2020 is some time away, but there is the special and then the series will come and people will be excited either way.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I watched it because I was curious and I admit I really liked the first season (and Eliza's appearance towards the end was a great bonus, not gonna lie), but the second season wasn't exactly up to par with what I liked about the show initially. I stopped midway to focus on other things and I meant to come back to it eventually and binge-watch the rest, but after reading and learning about all of this I'm not really motivated to anymore since it now leaves a bad taste in my mouth. :/

I think some are just worried about whether the show will lose its momentum with such a long hiatus in between seasons, but I think considering that there are still a lot of fans and people excited for the next season, as long as there will be promotion to continue to hype I think it'll be fine.

[orangerful.livejournal.com]

I guess my concern for Doctor Who is that it is going to lose its momentum after a relatively strong start to a new "series". But the fans will be there.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I think if fans, new and old, have remained with the show throughout its new season (which, as you mentioned, started off incredibly strong despite the previous ~controversy over certain claims from those no longer going to be watching all because the Doctor is now a woman) then waiting a little longer isn't going to hurt it. I think as long as they continue maintaining that interest in between, from interviews, SDCC/convention appearances, behind-the-scenes, etc, that momentum will keep going.

[squint13.livejournal.com]

Oh wow. What a disgusting man! I've watched NCIS, I've watched a few eps here and there of Bull and was considering maybe watching it all at some Point - pfft, nope, not anymore. I hope his ass is fired, and more so, I hope he doesn't get a new job easily.

Her employers shouöd've had her back. Instead they just pay her off to keep quiet, and also try to fram her as being the wrong one? What in the everloving heck. So many wrongs were done to her.

I hope her next job is a safe work space. <3

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Sadly, I don't think he'll lose his job. CBS has been very toxic with how they uphold the reputation of their male stars while vilifying the women. Plus, it's not the first time that Micheal Weatherly did something gross, since I'm reminded of his inappropriate relationship with a teenage Jessica Alba during Dark Angel. So, I doubt he'll be tainted from this since men usually never are in this industry despite there being concrete evidence backing up the harassment claims.

I just feel so sad for Eliza. :( I just want her to go out there and be successful and do something that makes her happy in a safe environment.

[squint13.livejournal.com]

Yeeah, I know. *sighs* I hate that. I really wish men who assaults people were punished harder than they are; most seem to either not have much of a consequence, or they take a 'break' and then make a 'comeback'. It's just. AAAAAAH. D:

Mm, I read about that in the link. I didn't know that, but it's not surprising. I don't understand why men in their thirties would even *consider* dating someone in their teens, but I guess majority of the times it's for power reasons. I mean, I'm simplifying it, but yeah. (i have feelings abt this bc some 37 yo dude is dating my 18 yo cousin, and it makes my skin crawl >.<) (and it's not the age difference per se that's upsetting - lots of people date people older than them; it's just that it feels like people take advantage, when the younger person is still young, even if they are technically an adult. idk. i'm not gonna go on, i just wanted to clarify ^^)

I wish for the day when men - and abusers in general - won't get off with just a slap on the wrist. It's so infuriating.

Same. She deserves all the good things and all the happiness.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

most seem to either not have much of a consequence, or they take a 'break' and then make a 'comeback'.

Yep, even if they are caught their punishments don't seem to be as severe as they should be. Some do, but the majority of the time they don't which is unfortunate. Meanwhile, women are constantly considered "gold diggers" and making "false accusations" even when they have solid evidence supporting their claims.

it's just that it feels like people take advantage, when the younger person is still young, even if they are technically an adult. idk. i'm not gonna go on, i just wanted to clarify ^^

I understand what you're saying. I don't mind age differences as long as the individuals are far along into their adulthood and are able to be equals in that partnership. But when you have a man in his early thirties being romantically interested in someone barely out of their teens, it's 100% a red flag for numerous reasons. It's predatory, first and foremost, because even if she is "of age" the fact that men prey on young girls like that and wait until she's 18 or something like that is so inherently gross. They do this because girls who are younger are inexperienced and don't understand the world yet, while women their own age can call out their bullshit. It's why you see older men grooming younger women a lot to believe this shit, they are legitimately taking advantage of them and it's reprehensible.

And I know Jessica Alba herself came forward some years ago about what happened and she didn't understand why she did what she did at that time, she was still very young and didn't understand the implications of not only dating someone twelve years older than her but also quickly to get engaged. He was the adult here and he should've known better.

Same as how he should've known better in this situation.

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

Well honestly from what I’ve heard online, he also really used his relationship with Jessica Alba as leverage to get better storylines on the show, and reading between the lines it does sound like Jessica Alba feels in hindsight that he was taking advantage of her

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that were the case. :/

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

In the past I wondered what happened to the writing of Logan on Dark Angel in fact, because I originally liked his character a lot, and then in the second season something about the writing really shifted and I just didn’t find him appealing any more. Knowing that there were behind the scenes reasons for the writers to dislike the actor kind of made sense of that to me, it likely would be hard to be objective about a character when you are having problems with the actor demanding script changes all of the time, and so I’m assuming that some of their dislike was coming across in the scripts

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

You know, you may have a point. Granted, season two was kind of disjointed in a lot of ways in general with the writing and direction, but there was definitely a shift with the writing for his character. I haven't rewatched S2 in quite a while now (it's my least favorite season of the whole show, tbh, so I don't really go back to it except for select episodes here and there) so my memory is a bit foggy about his particular storyline, but I do know that his character wasn't as interesting to me as he was in the first season, and aside from not liking the whole separation obstacle between Logan and Max, I couldn't quite put my finger as to why. But I guess in hindsight, knowing what we know now, it makes sense.

[malicat.livejournal.com]

CBS is so dominated by (white) men,is it any wonder that so many of them are assholes/abusers? I mean,men are the worst,on any network and in all kinds of other environments but I really think that CBS is the most toxic of them all. I feel so sad for Eliza,especially since she is basically the only loser in this scenario (and no,I don't count the money as winning if that is what she would have earned while actually WORKING). Why do men always get away with this kind of thing?
But sure,"false" accusations ruin their life/career *rolleyes*

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I mean,men are the worst,on any network and in all kinds of other environments but I really think that CBS is the most toxic of them all.

Yeah, I mostly hear about these kinds of things from CBS more than any other television network. It's disheartening, but it's also infuriating because how often it happens with almost no repercussions, both on screen and the execs from the network itself. And it's just really frustrating that, as a whole, even if they are caught and found guilty men hardly suffer actual real consequences for their actions.

[elizalavelle.livejournal.com]

I was so sad to read about that. Then I was enraged reading the comments from WOMEN about how she just couldn't take a joke. Listen, no network pays out 9.5 million over a joke that someone else didn't get.

I was really horrified by the fact the network handed over behind the scenes footage thinking that it incriminated Eliza because she was swearing (seriously wtf kind of logic is that?!) and then it turned out they had the harassment on film and NO ONE who vetted those tapes before handing them over recognized the harassment. How rampant must harassment be at that network that no one saw what was happening and recognized it as being outside of the norm?

I sent an email into CBS. I'm sure they won't care but this just bothered me a lot. Eliza is a recognizable actress. How many new actresses have had to face this guy and got nothing to compensate for being harassed? Not to mention how he likely treats the crew or women in general. What a gross man.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Then I was enraged reading the comments from WOMEN about how she just couldn't take a joke.

I made the mistake to look at Twitter to see the comments, and the fact that I saw a handful of people, women especially, blaming Eliza entirely is just so disgusting. I couldn't believe what I was seeing. Either saying that she could "take a joke" or that she was greedy for taking the settlement money. I did see a lot of support for her amidst those horrible comments though, so I hope that she sees those instead of the other hateful ones.

And you're right, there is no way that amount of money was given for simply a joke. Whatever was on that tape really proves that more was there, and the further that was pursued the more shit they were gonna be in.

How rampant must harassment be at that network that no one saw what was happening and recognized it as being outside of the norm?

It's unfortunately so rampant throughout the entire industry that a lot of it gets either unnoticed, dismissed, or kept quiet about, since the more things that are exposed the more that we hear that almost everyone seemed to have known yet were afraid to speak up about it, or how normalized it is that it's just somehow widely accepted despite it being reprehensible. It's why I hope that things like the Me Too movement has helped more and more people come out with their stories and reveal the things that happened to them, and get help and the support to those who are also suffering the abuse right now.

That's good that you sent an email. Idk if it'll do anything, but the more people complain about the way they operate the more I hope it leads to something being done in the future.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_profiterole_/]

I didn't know about Eliza. That sucks so much.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Yeah, the story just came out the other day revealing all of this, and it leaves me feeling so disgusted. Eliza is incredibly brave for standing her ground, despite knowing that this most likely would end up with her losing a stable role. She's had to deal with so much with the industry already, and having to add this to it is just, ugh.

[violateraindrop]

Sometimes I can't believe that Person of Interest was on that network or that they still have Elementary.

To be fair, Sarah Shahi said that the Nancy Drew show/pilot was bad which is not something a lot of actors would say. Then again, maybe that's just because it was on CBS. Another network might have greenlit/shot something better.

Anyway, I always enjoyed Michael on NCIS, so I was honestly shocked to hear about Eliza. I also got the impression that he supported his female NCIS co-stars and one of the reasons he left was how they treated Cote de Pablo. Things can change, sometimes for the worse.
The tape thing is so disgusting. WTF has cursing to do with anything? It's ridiculous that the network/lawyer didn't even realize that it was evidence of the harassment. How can that happen?

Since we always watched NCIS together, my mother and I checked out Bull once it started airing here in Germany. We dropped it after a couple of episodes. My mother really hated the show lol
I never had the urge to continue watching it either.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I know. Then again, I think it depends on the work environment for those individual shows, and unless we hear something I think they're incredibly lucky to not have had any issues with those that they work with.

Whether the pilot for the Nancy Drew reboot was terrible or not doesn't negate the fact that CBS initially said they wouldn't pick it up because it had too many women, as if that was a legitimate reason for not wanting to go ahead with it.

I have to admit I was a bit shocked myself at first, but then I remembered his inappropriate relationship with Jessica Alba back in the day. Sure, people can change and mature for the better over the years, but sometimes that's not always the case as seen here. I think what's really telling is how CBS handled the whole thing, which is unfortunately very predictable given their track record. While I'm glad that it went in favor of Eliza (even if inadvertently) it's still heartbreaking that this is essentially a lose-lose situation for her at the same time. She could have had a stable recurring job, but lost it due to the harassment and not having any kind of support and nearly getting blacklisted, and now some people are attempting to think that she's still a "bad" person for taking the settlement money. Just. *sigh*

I do hope that Eliza is doing well otherwise, though. She deserves happiness and I hope she gets to work on things she loves and is doing so in a better, safer, and healthier environment.

I admit to liking the first season of Bull a whole lot, but the second season was really losing me and I kinda drifted off from it a bit. I planned on binge-watching what I missed when I had the time, but now I've lost all interest in doing so. Especially knowing how they handled my favorite character on the show.

[violateraindrop]

Maybe nothing happened because NCIS wasn't "his" show. He also was kind like that during Dark Angel where he was the main male cast member. It's like guys only backing off when a girl says that she has a boyfriend. NCIS is Mark Harmon's show in that sense.

Honestly, considering the network this is coming from, they might have thought that it sounds better than just admitting that it was bad. They also don't think a lot of sexual harassment, misogyny is downright tame then.

I didn't know about their age difference until now and actually thought she was older (mostly because she's been around for a long time).

Yeah, I've seen people ask why she took the money like that somehow changes what happened :/

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that makes sense.

I knew he was older, but I didn't know how much older. I mean, I watched Dark Angel when it was airing and knew about their engagement (it came out of nowhere for me) but aside from thinking it was weird I didn't think much of it. It wasn't until years later I learned about how inappropriate that relationship actually was and what Jessica went through during her time on that show, plus how the writers/actors of the show apparently didn't like Michael all that much.

Yeah, I've seen people ask why she took the money like that somehow changes what happened :/

It really infuriates me whenever I see stuff like that. It's like victims of sexual harassment must act and behave A Certain Way and if they don't they get vilified and it's like....? No? Blaming the victim for how they deal with their own harassment is just vile, imho. It was going to be a lose-lose situation for her anyway, so she dealt with it the best she could at the time, which was all correct with how she approached both Michael and the network. It was them who mishandled the situation, not her. She did everything correctly. Just because she didn't act the way people expected her to is insulting and plain victim shaming, tbh.

[giallarhorn.livejournal.com]

On one hand, not surprised. CBS hasn't exactly had a great record in handling these things, to say the least. Still doesn't change the shitty way they handled it, or what happened to her.

The DW news is definitely weird. It's apparently doing better than ever before, so it makes me wonder why they'd delay down their best show by a year, even after reducing the number of eps per season?

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Yeah, my thoughts exactly. CBS is known for the shitty way they handle things, although you'd think that would change since it's so public esp now with what was revealed with how they handled this particular situation. But chances are nothing will happen, which sucks. I feel so bad for Eliza, she deserves better.

I'm not quite sure myself. I haven't really watched DW during the last few seasons but I have noticed that their production quality has upped significantly, so perhaps that could be a factor. But otherwise, I have no idea. I mean, like I mentioned I don't particularly mind the wait, but it does seem rather odd that after such a strong opening for the recent season they would wait a year before premiering the next one.

[frelling-tralk.livejournal.com]

I feel so horrible for Eliza :( And the amount of ignorant comments I’ve come across saying they would put up with a few jokes for the sake of a big payout is beyond belief. She got that money because Michael Weatherly got her fired by all accounts. She confronted him over his comments and said they weren’t appropriate for the workplace, there was then apparently an email from Weatherley to the network saying that he wanted to have a private meeting with them about Eliza’s lack of humour, and then she gets fired and blacklisted which is such bullshit when she did nothing wrong. She handled everything correctly in speaking to Weatherley and making it clear that he needs to draw a line under his comments when it’s affecting the on set atmosphere and the way that other people have started speaking to her.

It’s so disingenuous of him to now claim that he has nothing to do with her being fired, she was very clearly let go because she refused to play along with him. She got that settlement after she very rightly decided to pursue a case of unfair dismissal, and the network realised they had no choice but to pay up after the tapes backed up what Eliza was saying

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I completely agree with everything you wrote in this comment.

Seeing the aggressive comments bashing Eliza wasn't surprising or unexpected, it was just disheartening and enraging to read. Same with hearing about other actors giving Michael Weatherly support instead of Eliza. Again, it's not unexpected whenever shit like this happens, it's just majorly disappointing. Who cares if you know the guy and he's been nice to you? Just because he's someone you know doesn't mean he cannot be doing something inappropriate with someone else. I get that that's an automatic response people have when it's someone they know, it's hard to swallow if you have never had any problems with that person, but that's where you remain quiet until more information is brought up. And in this case, there was video evidence supporting Eliza's claims, a video that the network tried to use to discredit Eliza as a way of retaliation only for it to backfire on them severely. So, standing by someone who harassed someone doesn't make you look good, tbh. It is disrespectful to the victim because you're essentially placing blame on them by saying, "oh nothing happened to me so this guy is totally innocent." Just, ugh.

Sorry, all of this just riles me up. Especially since it's not that hard to understand the situation when it's written plainly on what happened. There is no excusing it.

[batmarg.livejournal.com]

I hadn't heard about Eliza. :( Bull didn't really interest me in the pilot, but I'm decided I'm NOT giving it another try

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

It broke my heart while reading it, but it also made me angry on her behalf at the same time.