Crossovers.

[rogueslayer452]

Sometimes I wished fandom fucked with crossovers more like it used to. *

Maybe I'm not looking in the right places since I know it stills happens, it's just that I remember when fandom crossovers were a massive thing especially during my early days in fandom. Yeah, fanfic fusion AUs exist, but it's not the same. There would be fanworks of various kinds where alternate universes featuring different fictional worlds would visit each other, either already existed in or created a kind of wormhole or portal to go into each other's world. It didn't need to make sense, it just needed to be like "how would these characters from this story interact with these others from this other story?" and that's that. But I rarely see those kinds of fanworks anymore, at least not in the way that it used to thrive in fandom spaces. I only see aspects of it now among the cdrama fandom. Of course, this is mere speculation on my part, I kinda theorize that the rise and fall of SuperWhoLock sort of got people to shy away from doing crossovers in such a way, because it was viewed as "cringe" since it was everywhere and dominated a lot of the fandomsphere especially on Tumblr. Which would be a shame if that were true. There is something amazing and uniquely fannish about crossovers, whether it be fanfiction, fanart, fanvids, or classic image manips, it's always been interesting to see the kinds of creativity fandom can come up with. You might not always know the fandoms in question, but it's nice to see people having fun.

(* I'm including myself in this as well, since I had once created some crossover fanworks in the past but have also unfortunately fallen off that wagon and need to get back on.)

Comments

[rhoda_rants]

This is fascinating to me, because crossovers are basically all I do. If it's not a crossover, it's a one-shot, most of the time. I do wonder if the SuperWhoLock thing had something to do with it. I was never part of that world, I've always just kinda done my own thing, and sometimes it resonates with people, but sometimes it doesn't. The "cringe" accusation bounces off me though because. It's fanfiction. It's ALL "cringe." I say embrace it and write what you want.

[author_by_night]

From what I've heard, in some fandoms, people who actually aren't all that fannish the way we are have discovered fanfic, and have started calling certain trends "cringe". I'm with you, fandom IS supposed to be "cringe".

( I discovered fanfic way back when because I was already a nerd. It was inevitable. Anyone who knows what fanfic is, should know I write it, basically. But maybe college kids who were on TikTok first don't know.)

[rhoda_rants]

Yeah, it's this weird popularity contest, or they keep talking about how you should "avoid" certain "trends" and I'm like—y'all. This is self-indulgent nonsense. There's no gate to keep. Stop it.

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[rogueslayer452]

The "cringe" accusation bounces off me though because. It's fanfiction. It's ALL "cringe." I say embrace it and write what you want.

Exactly. I find it strange that current fandom (in certain spaces) want to shame and judge people for simply liking something that they deem is "weird" and therefore "cringe". Fandom is about the shameless self-indulgence, and trying to suggest otherwise means they don't understand the point of what fandom is.

[author_by_night]

Yeah, fanfic fusion AUs exist, but it's not the same

Heh, I was thinking while reading this "there are still fusions" - however, you're right! Granted, I'm not in that many fandoms, so I'm not the best authority. But most of what I have seen have either been fusions, or more cameos than true crossovers. You're right, those are in very short supply. Which is a shame.

True story, I read a crossover once, but before I'd seen the other show. It was SO much fun to re-read once I had seen the show, because in the fic, the character mentions the guy he's seeing. On the show, said guy breaks his heart, leading the character to almost die of an overdose, subsequently leading the character's dad to move them to another state. It was actually a significant name drop. So of course reading the first time, I had no reaction to that guy's name being mentioned, whereas the second time I had that intended "oh shit" reaction. It was fun noting the dissonance.

part, I kinda theorize that the rise and fall of SuperWhoLock sort of got people to shy away from doing crossovers in such a way, because it was viewed as "cringe" since it was everywhere and dominated a lot of the fandomsphere especially on Tumblr

I hope that's not it! That would be a shame.

It didn't need to make sense, it just needed to be like "how would these characters from this story interact with these others from this other story?" and that's that.

That might actually be part of the problem, trying to make it make sense, when in fact, it doesn't HAVE to. You're exactly right, it's about having the characters interact.
It doesn't have to make perfect sense. Even in the fic I mentioned, it is highly unlikely that those characters would actually have interacted, even living in the same city, but that wasn't the point, was it?

I want to write a real crossover now. Hm.

[rogueslayer452]

So of course reading the first time, I had no reaction to that guy's name being mentioned, whereas the second time I had that intended "oh shit" reaction. It was fun noting the dissonance.

Interestingly, this also happens to me whenever I watch crossover episodes where I have watched only one show but not the other, and then when I do watch the other show (or at least get better knowledge of it) I'll have a similar reaction, because you get the full context. That's what I want to see more of with fandom crossovers, to be honest, just the sense of bringing people who aren't aware of all the fandoms involved but are curious enough to get context and so they'll understand what the significance or parallels of what is being referenced.

That might actually be part of the problem, trying to make it make sense, when in fact, it doesn't HAVE to. You're exactly right, it's about having the characters interact.

Yeah, and while it doesn't have to make sense it also does require a lot of effort to understand both canon worlds in order for the nonsensical reasons of them interacting, y'know? And I think for some, even if they like the idea of that, actually putting pen to paper to make it happen can be difficult to tackle. Also, some might even consider it too cracky to even consider putting it out there, again going with the "but it's cringe" mentality and thinking that it won't get them noticed in fandom. Which is bullshit, obviously.

[author_by_night]

That's what I want to see more of with fandom crossovers, to be honest, just the sense of bringing people who aren't aware of all the fandoms involved but are curious enough to get context and so they'll understand what the significance or parallels of what is being referenced.

Definitely!

Pen to paper is one of the reasons I haven't written more crossovers, for sure. Also the fact that even though in my head, certain worlds share a 'verse, I don't necessarily know how I'd bring them together.

Are there really a lot of fans who are worried about "cringe"? That's so sad to me.

Are there a lot of Friendly Fandoms left? I wonder if that's part of it as well. I feel like in the days of SuperWhoLock, for instance, a lot of people were in those fandoms. I know it's still very much a thing for fans to follow one another to new media, but that doesn't necessarily translate to fanfic. (From what I've seen, too, it's been less crossovers and more "we met through Fandom X, we've collectively moved on to Fandom Y". That's just my experience, of course.)

[elizalavelle]

Oh man, I remember reading some random Buffy fics where they were dropped in with other shows, some were terrible and some were fantastic but it almost always was fun.

I liked seeing people having more fun in fannish spaces and just being happier there. It's always nice when I find a fandom where the vibe feels nostalgic.

[rogueslayer452]

Same here, whether I was reading or just seeing people doing manip graphics back in the day, it was something absolutely amazing to see people having fun exploring the different ways and possibilities two separate canon universes could interact, no matter whether it was something serious or just indulging in some silly shenanigans.

I liked seeing people having more fun in fannish spaces and just being happier there. It's always nice when I find a fandom where the vibe feels nostalgic.

Yeah, it's always a blessing whenever you come across that feeling. :)

[author_by_night]

The thing with Buffyverse is, parallel universes are canon, so proper crossovers actually make sense. I'm actually hemming and hawing on one myself.

[elizalavelle]

Write it :) What crossover are you thinking of?

[author_by_night]

This is the silliest combo pack of a crossover ever, but Schitt's Creek. Not sure if you ever finished watching, but one of the characters makes a reference to "farm witches" and I can't help but Go There. So the farm witches are Tara and Willow. There aren't any vampires in the 'verse, but there may be demons.

Also, that same character reminds me a bit of Cordelia in Angelverse, in terms of a formerly spoiled character who has to learn how to actually be a good person.

[elizalavelle]

Haven't watched all of it but I'm delighted by Willow and Tara as farm witches.

I guess it's Alexis?

[harlow_turner_chaotic_ace]

I still see some crossovers on Ao3-- mostly fics that are massive crossovers between 5+ different fandoms. But I only really know a couple people who actively write crossover fics. I've written a couple, but not very many, I have to admit.

Oh, if you're interested in crossovers with the Buffyverse and other media, you might check out Twisting the Hellmouth; it's an active archive dedicated to Buffyverse crossovers: https://www.tthfanfic.org/

[rogueslayer452]

I've also seen some crossovers on AO3, but I feel like fusions have kind of taken over in popularity in recent years.

Thank you for recommending that site! I just took a peek and it definitely reminds me of the older fanfic/fanwork archives from years ago, and looking it up briefly it was from that era that I was referencing! Particularly of when I first started getting into online fandom and searching around at that time. It's amazing that it's still up and running. :D So awesome.

[trobadora]

This is so fascinating to me because I see more crossovers now than I used to. I never noticed them much back in the day, and even the infamous SuperWhoLock - well, I know it was supposedly everywhere at one time, but I was in Doctor Who and peripherally in SPN and Sherlock but can't remember coming across it much beyond one or two vids or pieces of art that crossed over two of them. I never even heard of SuperWhoLock as a thing until way after the fact. It really does all depend on what corners of fandom you happen to be in! *g*

If there's less of it now, I totally buy that it's because so much modern fandom seems to be anti-"cringe", ugh. (I don't believe in "cringe". We're here to enjoy ourselves!)

[rogueslayer452]

It really does all depend on what corners of fandom you happen to be in! *g*

It really does. Fandom is incredibly vast and spans many corners of the Internet, and while some things can break containment and be featured elsewhere (even without much context), you will most likely never hear about or come across most big things happening in those corners of online fandom.

If there's less of it now, I totally buy that it's because so much modern fandom seems to be anti-"cringe", ugh. (I don't believe in "cringe". We're here to enjoy ourselves!)

Yeah, exactly.

[corvidology]

I've always loved crossovers, not fusions, and I've written and read a lot of them.

[rogueslayer452]

I'm picky and selective with the fanfic I read in general, but I have dabbled in reading both fusions and crossovers over the years, although I think the former has become way more common nowadays than the latter. From what I've seen, anyway.

[corvidology]

I think part of the reason why I never liked fusions much is because it often involves a fandom I know nothing about/I'm not interested in. All those Harry Potter fusions...

I don't read very much fan fiction at all anymore but it does seem there are more fusions around.

[rogueslayer452]

For me, from what I've seen most of the time is that fusions are done in a similar way that high school AUs or coffee shop AUs are, that they're merely backdrops but don't really explore the world. With crossovers it forces the characters to interact with the world and their surroundings, which makes it more interesting and requires more effort in figuring out how each world works and how things would be if characters from another canon were to interact with another universe, the cause and effect and consequences therein.

[corvidology]

That's exactly why intoabar is one of my favourite challenges.

[autumndaze]

At least in my experience it definitely depends on the fandom, because I see them a lot, especially in fanart. I've seen a lot fic-wise in the danmei fandoms I've been in, and in many others, particularly manhwa fandoms. Personally I do a mix of fusions and actual crossovers (like I have some for Tomb Raider/ENNEAD, God of War/ENNEAD, Given/Hunter X Hunter, with the actual characters interacting). So far as I'm aware it's still quite popular in Sonic and Square Enix fandoms, too, though for obvious reasons with like anything involving Kingdom Hearts and/or Final Fantasy.

[rogueslayer452]

Yeah, it really does depend on the fandom, as well as the platform you're on since a particular fandom might not be incredibly active or popular in one space but it really is thriving in another.

I'm mostly thinking about the acceptance of general fandom overall, because although I was exposed to crossovers during my early days of fandom I have no idea how niche even that genre is within fandom spaces as a whole. Of course, as you said, every individual fandom is different, some are more accepting of the concept than others, and I think as long as you find those little communities of your fandom that have what you're looking for it doesn't matter what the rest of the fandom (specific or in general) think.

[autumndaze]

Yeah, for me, I run into them basically everywhere lol For active fandoms, some of the most popular works these days are "reaction" crossover fanfics (e.g., Edward Elric watching the events of Dragon Ball Z) or reader crossover fics, or just plain crossover fics. Even some of the quieter fandoms, the handful of fics that exist are often (frustratingly, for me) crossovers lol It doesn't help that in three of my fandoms, two of which are incredibly popular Korean novels and manhwa, two of the most popular ships are crossovers. And crossover ships are pretty popular in most of the danmei I've seen. It's one reason I'm glad filtering out crossovers exists on Ao3, even if it doesn't grab everything due to tagging.

I'm also a bit biased in that I was so overwhelmed by crossovers in my early days in fandom that they turned me right off the concept entirely. One of the earliest scams I got introduced to on fanfiction.net involved someone trying to "make" a giant crossover fanfic similar to Kingdom Hearts. I only got into writing my own crossovers relatively recently and it gave me appreciation for it as a concept, though I'm still not a fan of massive crossovers. But at least in my experience, crossovers definitely thrive in many, many fandoms on Ao3, fanfiction.net, Wattpad, and tumblr.

[tinny]

I was going to say that this is very very common in cdrama fandoms, but you mention that, too. There, it's so ubiquitous that 90% of fics are crossovers, and I remember being annoyed at there being so few non-crossover fics. Crossovers have the disadvantage that you have to have seen the relevant canons, and in cdrama especially, there are *so many* I haven't seen. (So this is obviously a me-problem.)

I kinda theorize that the rise and fall of SuperWhoLock sort of got people to shy away from doing crossovers in such a way, because it was viewed as "cringe"

Oh, that's an interesting theory. I wouldn't hope so, since people have always tended to write what they wanted and it's all niche anyway. Although it was very common back then, so common that it might have been the mainstream, and thus different rules might apply. It definitely didn't have the "i haven't seen the other canon" problem, not for me nor I assume many others. :D

[rogueslayer452]

There, it's so ubiquitous that 90% of fics are crossovers, and I remember being annoyed at there being so few non-crossover fics.

Especially if the fandom is small to begin with where there are so few fics in general, and yet the majority of them are crossovers.

Like, I get it, having a crossover between two different dramas (particularly if it features characters played by actors who were together in a completely different drama) is very tempting, and this happens with non-Asian fandoms too at times, but it can be frustrating when that's all you see.

[tinny]

Yes. I've seen fandom tags filled with crossovers, before the show in question has even aired. People just take the new character name from a fandom they know their blorbo will star in and then write a story without even knowing anything about him apart from his name. No characteristics, no plot, nothing. I honestly don't get it.