Well, that's certainly a thing they did.

[rogueslayer452]

++ Since it was announced that Netflix's Marvel shows will be leaving the service, it has been confirmed that they will be moving to Disney+ later this month. I suspected that would be the case. I still would love to have all those shows on DVD, though.

++ So, the Tolkien Estate just went full-on Sackville-Baggins with their newest updated policies.

On the surface, the requests and demands are utterly ridiculous and it would be impossible to enforce the majority of these considering how much Tolkien's work has been majorly influential worldwide. However, many have shown concern because this is, like, Anne Rice levels of attempting to control/police fans and the transformative works they create, just extended even further to any mention of Tolkien and his work in anything, unless you specifically ask permission from the Tolkien Estate. This isn't about maintaining the integrity of Tolkien's legacy, it's about money and greed and control, nothing more. I don't know what's going to happen, or if anything will come from this. I'm just so flabbergasted by it all, to be honest.

++ In more fun news, The Legend of Vox Machina made it to WatchMojo.com's Top Ten Moments videos. That's when you know you've made it. (Although small mistake as most fans are pointing out: Pike is a cleric, not a paladin.) Either way though, I just think this is so cool and nifty, is all.

Comments

[author_by_night]

I don't understand why they're only objecting to fanworks and fanzines now. Most people have gotten used to the concept of fanworks, and fanzines have been around since the 1960's. So has fanfiction,* but I think people were more aware of fanzines than fanfic until maybe ten, fifteen years ago.

*I know technically fanfic's been around since the dawn of literature, but as an official term.

I think you might be right that it's about greed and control. :/ That being said, I would like to state for the record (while very much preaching to the choir, I realize) that fanfic doesn't harm the original work.

[rogueslayer452]

I don't understand it, either. Some have speculated that this might all correlate with the fact that the last of Tolkien's children recently passed away, and whoever the Estate has in charge now is taking advantage of having full control. Again, it's mere speculation, but considering the timing it's far too convenient to be coincidence.

[profiterole_reads]

I've heard of the Tolkien estate's shenanigans. I hope they don't cause actual problems to their fans.

[rogueslayer452]

The policies are that outrageous that it seems impossible to imagine that they can be enforced, but usually they, unfortunately, target specific people, aka fans who don't have the money or resources to fight back. That's what happened when Anne Rice went after fans back in the day, she literally drove her own fanbase underground, and some worry that might happen with LOTR/Tolkien fans should any of this actually be enforced. And it's a very valid thing to be concerned about.

It's both ridiculously baffling and concerning at the same time. It's a kerfuffle that I didn't expect to occur, but here we are.

[montmartres]

Now that the shows are officially moving I hope they will be rebooted somehow! I need more Jessica Jones in my life.

[rogueslayer452]

Part of me wants more Jessica Jones (because I miss her terribly, too), but the other part of me does not want them MCU-ified. These shows were fine standing on their own without being directly connected with the MCU whatsoever. Unfortunately, now that Matt Murdock made a brief cameo in the recent Spider-man film and Kingpin was in Hawkeye, it seems like they might want to integrate the characters from these shows into their strictly MCU-based shows which, eh, not really a fan of to be honest. I want them to finish their own stories rather than be briefly featured in someone else's, if that makes sense.

[autumndaze]

Someone I follow wondered if it was Amazon putting pressure on the Tolkien estate to be stricter about this, which could be the case I suppose, but I'm not sure what good it would do either of them, since it seems pretty unenforceable, unless Amazon starts pulling a Disney and copyright-claiming any orc or elf characters and saying it's a rip-off of their "Rings of Power" show (ie., how Disney copyright-claimed anyone making Loki merch, even when it wasn't of the Marvel character), but that might even put Amazon's money to the test. And it's not like Amazon can enforce Tolkien's copyright for the Tolkien estate, just "Rings of Power" stuff. Imagine if Amazon started going after fanart for the MGM/WB films... or the animated ones...

It's all so stupid.

[rogueslayer452]

That was initial thought too, and it's not that far off from what you'd expect from a mega corporation like Amazon, however I also agree with your sentiment that it just doesn't seem like it would benefit either party in that case. I agree that they would more or less just want to protect their product of The Rings Of Power more than just Tolkien overall.

There's also the fact that the youngest of Tolkien's children just recently passed away, so it's rather sus that all of this is happening now all of a sudden....

We don't really know the certain what's going on, who is behind all of these decisions and why now, it's all speculation at the moment. I think we can all agree that these policy changes are ridiculous and so stupid. Even the wording of them seems so condescending, too, it's just laughable.

[blackcatofmisery]

I didn't know the Tolkien people were so uptight. I just love the wording of the fanzine part. "It can't be used without permission, which we wouldn't give to you, anyway." I really don't see how they can police the entire world. Fans aren't trying to make money off the series and name, anyway. (Maybe fanartists, who sell their art, but they don't chose their subject solely with money in mind.)

It's definitely about greed and control, though. If it was me, I'd encourage the people to go buck wild. Just easier that way and much less stress. A lot more fun, too.

=^..^=~

[rogueslayer452]

Yeah, the wording comes across as super condescending, it's almost laughable in a way. Aside from being ridiculous and stupid, it's also just so bizarre.

[blackcatofmisery]

Do you know what the policy was previously? Like, what happened that they changed it all so strictly? Tolkien himself has been dead for decades, so it can't have anything to do with that.

[rogueslayer452]

I never previously checked their policies, so I don't know for sure.

Well, the last of his children did recently pass away, although whether or not that has any correlation it's all speculation since we don't really know what's going on or why the sudden need to revamp the policies in such a drastic way.

[blackcatofmisery]

It really could be anything. Maybe the family burned through all the money and want to try and guarantee they get every penny possible. Or, they could be the ones most up in arms over the new show and don't want to see anyone attempt to recreate the environment and characters ever. :/a It totally boils down to greed, though. There is no harm in fan-created content (except among fans themselves, when they get butthurt over someone else's take, but that's everywhere and never going to go away).

[goodbyebird]

I spotted them attacking someone on Twitter not long ago for using a picture of Tolkien in a tweet about it being his birthday with "do you have the rights to this image??" and straight up calling them a thief for using it. Very bad vibes all around.

And yes, all the Defenders shows turn up on Disney+ March 16th. I honestly don’t see why it couldn’t stay up on both. After all, Netflix produced them :/

[rogueslayer452]

Yeah, I read about that. It's just so bizarre, this whole thing. I do wonder what the end goal is, aside from greed and control.

Sadly, that's the downside of this streaming war nonsense, it's a competition to see who gets ownership of which IP. In an ideal world we would have the shows be available onto both platforms along with DVD releases of each of their seasons, but that's not how things work, unfortunately. Which sucks.

[elizalavelle]

WTF Tolkien Estate?!

I'm just reading a book about CS Lewis (fictional) that has Tolkein in it as they were friends... like would that just not be allowed anymore? So much of his work has become part of cultural discourse I feel like a move like that is really dumb from a legal standpoint. If you want to keep that level of copyright you need to defend your copyright whenever it's violated... Do these people want to just pay a team of lawyers to work 24/7?

I'm glad Disney+ got the shows but I do wish more streaming shows put out DVDs. I don't like not having control of being able to watch things when I want to watch.

[rogueslayer452]

My thoughts exactly. It seems rather daunting considering how massively influential Tolkien's works have been for decades, and kind of pointless to try and enforce all these ridiculous policies now which, with the framing of their wording, seems to be more about control than anything else. Stroking the ego of whoever is running things with the Estate.

(I suspect that if anything does happen, it won't be towards anything big like, say, Stephen Colbert, but more targeting those who are less likely to fight back such as smaller creators or fans. But either way, idk.)

I'm glad Disney+ got the shows but I do wish more streaming shows put out DVDs. I don't like not having control of being able to watch things when I want to watch.

Yeah. It really sucks that a lot of shows aren't being put out on DVD anymore because of these damn streaming wars. :/

[elizalavelle]

I mean even if they go after smaller targets - it'll just take one lawyer who is willing to take on a case who can point to something like the Colbert Show and say "did you sue them? No? Then you gave up your right to defend that policy here as you're not consistently defending it."

*I'm not a lawyer but I believe there's stuff with copyrights that make picking and choosing what to defend more difficult.

The Streaming Wars are going to end the same way the Cable Wars did - piracy. Eventually even users who want to buy the services can't afford to have all of them.