The price of being a fan in fandom.

[rogueslayer452]

++ I just found out that ThinkGeek closed its online store recently and have relocated by integrating with GameStop instead (which is kind of a downgrade imho, aesthetically and functionally). I have always looked on the ThinkGeek site for anything new and interesting with fandom/geeky merch, and have bought things from time to time, but I do agree with some of the criticisms that some of the stuff was a bit too overpriced and they didn't really update a whole lot in recent years. I'm just sad I missed their "moving out" sale since I was dealing with health issues during the time it happened, I could have gotten great deals on things I had always wanted to get.

++ Wil Wheaton is suing Geek & Sundry over profits of a webseries he created. Although I had watched G&S since it debuted, I've been hearing some unfavorable things ever since it was sold to Legendary (LDN) years ago and the changes they'd started making once they took over and the clashing between them and the staffers/creators. So yeah, I hope he wins.

++ Tumblr has been bought by the owner of Wordpress for less than 3 million dollars, which is significantly less than what it was originally bought for by Yahoo years ago. It's kind of hilarious seeing big corporations who clearly never understood the platforms they were buying (Yahoo legitimately thought that Tumblr was "the next generation PDF" which...what?) and thinking they could profit off of ending up with a massive financial loss for fucking it up big time, but it does leave the question of what this means for the site now. The ban on adult content and the shitty algorithm is still up unfortunately, which won't win people back that either left or were forced out, and despite claims that nothing will change we've all heard that song and dance before. The fate and longevity of the site is still up in the air, and many, especially those among the fandomsphere, are worried what this means. Tumblr might not have been originally created to be for fandom use, but fandom did migrate there and it became one of the biggest platforms to host fannish content and it's what caused its rise in popularity. But without it, where would people go? There is no other site that is comparable to it. I've said this before, but ideally we need a solution that is similar to that of AO3/OTW where a non-profit fandom platform is created by fans for fans, but realistically I know it isn't that simple. So for right now, it's just a big question mark of what the future holds.

Comments

[violateraindrop]

I remember finding ThinkGeek and admiring the merch. Shipping and import taxes would have been more expensive than the items I wanted to buy, but merch like that wasn't available in Germany back then. Things have definitely improved and I have seen some of the products sold on ThinkGeek in German stores. There are probably a ton of other stores now, but it's always weird to see an established company disappear.

Tumblr was "the next generation PDF"
What is that even supposed to mean?
I've seen somewhere that Automattic is rather picky when it comes to acquire companies, so I wonder what their plan is.

we need a solution that is similar to that of AO3/OTW
I agree, but I also see how it'll be hard to implement. Pillowfort wanted to be an alternative, but never really took off.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Yeah, when I discovered ThinkGeek years ago I thought it was fantastic since I saw things I didn't see before. But my visits ended up dwindling over the years because a lot of the stuff was too expensive and I kept waiting to see if the prices would be knocked down or they would just be out of stock. ThinkGeek still has their physical stores up, wherever they are located, just their own online store closed. And like you said, though, a lot that you could find on their store you could find elsewhere for a cheaper price.

What is that even supposed to mean?

I honestly don't know. I don't think they even knew. Perhaps they thought that gifs were similar to PDF? But still that makes no sense because they're not even related. I think they were just saying random things but didn't really understand what they were saying, which is kind of obvious since they clearly didn't understand what Tumblr was.

I've seen somewhere that Automattic is rather picky when it comes to acquire companies, so I wonder what their plan is.

I heard that aside from Wordpress, they don't really own anything else, so that makes sense. But it does make me curious what the future will be.

I agree, but I also see how it'll be hard to implement. Pillowfort wanted to be an alternative, but never really took off.

I think Pillowfort had good intentions at first, but aside from it not taking off I've heard unfavorable things about those who run it, specifically with how they chose to run it (i.e. vague TOS, moral policing, etc) which is nagl. It's why if there is ever to be an attempt of making an alternative fandom platform for everyone it needs to have the right people behind it that know how to create a website and maintain it. I would want those at OTW to help with this, those who probably helped create AO3 since they have experience of understanding how this is to work.

[honeymink]

I'm never really up to date with these things but I saw Pillowfort around in February or so and thought about joining but then wasn't so sure about it. So what is this controversy around it? And where are things now?

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

So what is this controversy around it? And where are things now?

I don't really follow anyone who really uses it, and honestly the last time I checked the update on something about it was months ago so idk how recent anything is or if things have changed since then. But I had heard that the people who ran it were either banning or deleting people for violating their TOS, which in itself was incredibly vague (they had a "don't post anything underage" which then later translated to "anything that appears to be underage even if it isn't will be prohibited" which is, yeah, just incredibly dangerous since this can make people targets for being wrongly harassed), and just moral policing in general that had many people concerned or disappointed with the direction they chose to take with running the site. Considering that people want an alternative to get away from banning creative content, having the "purity culture" mindset while creating a site that is meant to host a variety of things in fandom isn't the best decision.

I don't know about where things are now, if things have changed or have just remained the same. I don't know if that place is ever going to gain traction, since it seems most have forgotten about it or are avoiding it for the reasons I mentioned above. But the site never looked appealing to me anyway, so.

[honeymink]

I think I briefly considered it because I was told that it had the blogging with picture hosting capacity of tumblr while it also had a comment thread structure etc. similar to Livejournal which I honestly thought would be an ideal way to "marry" platforms. What always bothered me about tumblr was that discussions couldn't be had properly given how you could kind of leave a comment but then somebody would have to pick it up again in their own post to reply to it and that was all chaos. But then I sometimes wonder how much discussions on meta fandom wants to have anyway these days. It seems often to me that people just write their piece and live for the likes and reblogs without any added comment/value except the occasional 'THIS!!'. Maybe I'm wrong. But yes, what you are describing about arbitarily deleting things and no clear TOS... I mean idk... appears 'underage' -- that's tricky, how do you decide that if not arbitrarily.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

I was told that it had the blogging with picture hosting capacity of tumblr while it also had a comment thread structure etc. similar to Livejournal which I honestly thought would be an ideal way to "marry" platforms.

Ideally that would be a fantastic middle ground, and it's not a bad idea. I also have that issue with Tumblr because I interact less with people there, making the experience very impersonal. I've noticed over the years that some are claiming that journaling/blogging platforms are most likely going to be obsolete in light of the popularity social media outlets. Both aren't mutually exclusive, they can co-exist, but the sad thing about "open forum" platforms are the lack of moderating and communicating with others that isn't just yelling into a void. Having a new platform that merges the best qualities of both is actually a good idea.

But then I sometimes wonder how much discussions on meta fandom wants to have anyway these days.

I honestly think it's more likely than you realize. Although the way Tumblr operates doesn't allow much for discussions to happen as easily as it would in comment threads, I have seen a lot of posts that have meta-esque aspects to them and some articulate responses, so the interest is still there. If it were on a platform that is easier to write and get direct responses without the conversation/post getting derailed, as if often happens on Tumblr, I think we'd be seeing a lot more fandom meta. Fandom was filled with tons of meta not too long ago, and it only lessened when the platform it migrated to couldn't really sustain it as it once had. Fandom has adapted before, and it will again, so hopefully when the next platform emerges it will have a way of supporting actual fandom discussions like it used to. Because I agree, I miss having the really detailed meta discussions and talking with other fans about something, especially in long comment threads where you could keep track of the conversations you're having.

(I do agree that the like/reblog validation is not good, which is a symptom of the platforms like social media has become with people feeling wanted by a like instead of connecting with people via comments, but that's something else worth looking into entirely.)

But yes, what you are describing about arbitarily deleting things and no clear TOS... I mean idk... appears 'underage' -- that's tricky, how do you decide that if not arbitrarily.

It's one of the many dangerous aspects of purity culture that has unfortunately infiltrated a lot of online spaces, especially fannish spaces, which is very arbitrary in the way they do things, aka want to censor things. It's why I wouldn't want to join a site/community where these kinds of rules are enforced. It's one thing to set up guidelines, but it's another to basically prohibit things entirely that fall into a complete gray area without thinking it through. It's such a slippery slope and ends up becoming the death of fandom spaces, tbh.

[violateraindrop]

I totally thought ThinkGeek was just an online store. At the time, merch availability in Germany was so limited that the stuff you could get here was also very expensive. ThinkGeek seemed very cheap to me if it wasn't for shipping and taxes.

Apparently, the boss of Wordpress really likes Tumblr? Maybe they wanted to save it from getting run into the ground completely.

Okay, I never even heard about what's going on behind the scenes. People I followed posted about having an account and how promising it looked. That's really all I know. The hype died down very fast. Just like everyone got a Vero for a hot second.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

ThinkGeek seemed very cheap to me if it wasn't for shipping and taxes.

As it is with most shopping online, tbh. I'll see something that I think I can afford, before realizing that it doesn't factor in tax and shipping costs. It's why I wait until there are sales or where I can use discount codes on.

Apparently, the boss of Wordpress really likes Tumblr? Maybe they wanted to save it from getting run into the ground completely.

Maybe. I haven't read much further into the whole business side of things or the reasons behind buying it at such a low price.

People I followed posted about having an account and how promising it looked. That's really all I know. The hype died down very fast.

That does happen a lot whenever there's a kind a fear of there being an exodus from a website. There will be attempts at creating and migrating to alternative places, usually similar to the place where they're leaving to have that familiarity, which may be fine for a while, but most will be unsuccessful. It did receive hype at first because people were worried about whether Tumblr/their accounts were going to disappear so they quickly made accounts there as a backup, but eventually when nothing was really happening they just continued to be on Tumblr and not really bothering with the other place, most likely because nobody was on there. I never really followed anyone who actively used Pillowfort, and currently I barely hear anyone talking about it at all. So yeah, it's pretty much been forgotten.

(And really, if the moral crusading is still happening with the administrators over there I wouldn't even bother joining since I don't trust anyone who creates a site with the intent of censoring things; being in fandom for a long time censorship does more harm than good and it really destroys fandom as a whole instead of helping it.)

[violateraindrop]

I totally forgot that taxes aren't included in the US. For me, there would have been import taxes on top of it (which aren't too cheap) and the higher shipping prices to Europe. To be honest, I don't mind shipping costs that much, but Germany/Europe is smaller, so it makes sense that they are not that high compared to the US.

Nobody really mentioned anything after the initial hype. I doubt many people are using it still.

I read your other reply. That's just setting the whole thing up for failure and a disgruntled userbase.

[blakmagjick]

I haven't been a fan of ThinkGeek for a while...sadly. Cause they did have a lot of awesome stuff...I do still have a bunch of things from that site around my house.
The GameStop shops just weren't as good IMO.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

They really did, but every time I looked, aside from getting some stuff from newer releases (Marvel, Star Wars, etc), they didn't really update much of their merchandising, which sucked. I always kept checking to see if there were in stock or if their prices had gone down, but they never did. :/ It also seems like they are severely downsizing their section at GameStop from what they used to have, with only the popular things and none of the other cool things they used to have.

It's kind of like how I felt about Her Universe stuff. I liked her website when it first launched, but now it seems the stuff sold is more pricey and cheaply made than how it used to be, which is a bummer.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_profiterole_/]

I knew about Tumblr, but not about the other info. Thanks for the update! :-)

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

You're welcome. :)

[author-by-night.livejournal.com]

I've said this before, but ideally we need a solution that is similar to that of AO3/OTW where a non-profit fandom platform is created by fans for fans,

That's exactly what we need, a very similar concept by fans for fans, rather than finding homes on sites that don't really care about fandom, or that aren't really fan specific. But you're exactly right, it just isn't that simple.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Yeah, you would need the right people to be part of the process, people with knowledge and experience with making websites, who understand the ins and outs of how to go about things, etc. In theory it would be wonderful to have a fandom platform that isn't beholden to any corporation wanting to monetize off of it, but creating a non-profit fandom platform would be trickier than just creating a normal website. There's a lot more to it than many think, especially if this is going to be something that gains a lot of traffic from use.

[author-by-night.livejournal.com]

I think this was honestly easier in the 90's and 2000's when everything was website based. Remember when there were web rings? Stuff like that made sites a bit easier, although as someone who tried to start a few, that was no guarantee of success. But it came more often, whatever you think of some of those sites. I don't even know if there are still fansites. Are there?

Plus... I don't want to sound like one of those geeky bros who are all "basic normies ruined everything waaah." But.... the abundance of casual fans in fandom spaces does make it harder. And there's nothing wrong with being a casual fan. I am a casual fan of many things. However, if you're trying to garner the sort of fan interest and love that Harry Potter, Buffy and The X-Files had (to name just a few), people whose idea of engagement is "this episode was good" really... are not who you're going to rally into a deeper, nerdier experience.

(It's like when a Star Wars fan tried to have a deep dive with me. As a VERY casual fan, I was like "I have no idea who any of those people are." So there you go. Now I don't even know if I qualify as a casual fan, given that I haven't seen the second newer movie. Just the first. But even before that, I liked Star Wars just enough to talk about the very basics.)

On the other hand, you could argue that said rallying ignites fandom feels. I always liked Harry Potter a lot, but it really wasn't until I found all of these sites and forums that my obsession began, because I had a space for it. That's also how I really found fandom. I'd technically dabbled before, but nowhere close to that. Now, Harry Potter is kind of an unfair standard because even for 2000-2007, that fandom was ginormous. And I do think former HP fandomers were a bit naive to the reality, which may be why a lot of the original fandomers aren't really into fandoms anymore. Still, even if most fandoms were significantly smaller, they still had more grounded homes. As sites dwindled people tried to make LJ home, but I think enough has been said there.

but creating a non-profit fandom platform would be trickier than just creating a normal website.

Yeah, I think that would be most ideal, but it's also much trickier.

[orangerful.livejournal.com]

I had a bad feeling about ThinkGeek earlier this year when I got a gift card and went to browse and lots of things were sold out and didn't seem to be getting replenished or even replaced. I did manage to snag a few things during the moving sale, but most of the stuff I wanted was already gone. :\

Wondering how much longer Tumblr has for this world...

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that was always my problem with ThinkGeek. There would be something I wanted but it would be sold out, and it would take forever for it to be restocked, if it ever did. And yet they just kept the "sold out" picture there whenever I kept coming back to check. And things I kept holding off of because they were too pricey, but anytime there was a sale happening it would instantly be sold out. So I think they weren't that great with keeping up with that, which is probably one of the reasons for this move from their own site to join with GameStop. It also seems that they are downsizing their merch over there for only the popular stuff, which also sucks because I did like finding the more obscure random things.

Wondering how much longer Tumblr has for this world...

It will either disappear or fade into obscurity, much like LJ because fandom moved from LJ long ago (for valid reasons at the time) and yet we're still here. It just really depends....

[orangerful.livejournal.com]

Gamestop had bought them a few years ago...perhaps this was always the plan? Too bad though, I think the name "Think Geek" is way more fun than "Gamestop".

And I'm going to miss Timmy and his outfits.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

ThinkGeek will still exist, if I'm reading into this correcting. They still have physical stores around in certain areas, at least for the time being, it's just their online store that has integrated into GameStop which is why I think ThinkGeek will still remain their own brand and be around even if they're doing this. Although it makes me wonder how well their online business actually was in sales if they had to go this direction. I agree, though, that ThinkGeek is a better name as a whole, since it is incorporating all things geeky and nerdy for everyone. And their site was better to operate too, lol oop.

Yeah, every time I bought something from them I would get the Timmy sticker in the package with my purchase. I don't think they'll be doing that now that they're combined with GameStop.

[icecoldrain.livejournal.com]

I've never checked out ThinkGeek but it's weird that they've integrated with GameStop when GameStop has been having a lot of problems for some time and people who work there say they don't expect it to be open much longer. I wonder if it'll go online only as time goes on like Blockbuster did.

Tumblr was "the next generation PDF"
I'm so confused. What is that even supposed to mean? I'm trying to think of what a next gen PDF would be and I'm thinking of some fancier and snazzy PDF land of some sort and def not tumblr.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Huh, interesting. No wonder that's why I saw so many comments re: GameStop being horrible. Perhaps this was a decision in thinking that ThinkGeek might save GameStop? I know that GameStop has Funko Pops in their stores to help sales, but obviously that's not enough so clearly they are struggling and need more help in that department. But idk, it'll be sad if both go under if this doesn't work.

I'm so confused. What is that even supposed to mean? I'm trying to think of what a next gen PDF would be and I'm thinking of some fancier and snazzy PDF land of some sort and def not tumblr.

I don't think they even knew what they meant. It puzzled everyone who was at that conference. I think it was just Yahoo attempting to sound "smart" and "business savvy" when in reality they were just saying nonsense since they had no idea what they were talking about. It's hilarious looking back now at the failed promises and talks that Yahoo did years ago, clearly it didn't work out for them because they were so full of shit. This is why big companies buying things they don't understand never works out.

[icecoldrain.livejournal.com]

Yeah, GameStop has a lot of problems, which is why many don't like them. Off the top of my head, if you pre-order a game to pick up in store, they will legit sell your copy before you arrive if a lot of people are buying the game and they ran out of non-pre-ordered copies. It's seemingly small but if you pre-ordered a limited edition special edition game that comes with goodies and they sell it before you get there, that's just extra messed up. One of my brother's friends used to work at GameStop and they'll tell you it was an accident but employees are pressured to sell the pre-orders to non-pre-order people by the company itself.

GameStop has been selling a lot of other merchandise for sometime to try and keep up because selling games as their primary stock isn't keeping anyone afloat anymore. They've got board games, plushes, mugs, etc. etc. now.

lmao yeah everyone knew Yahoo was full of it and suspected they'd just make a lot of bad mistakes and, well, that's exactly what happened. They couldn't even get their porn ban right because everyone posting food, dogs, family photos, etc are getting flagged while porn bots are going strong.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

That definitely is not good of a business model, tbh. I'm surprised they're able to get away with it, and it is extra shitty to pressure employees in such a position, basically lying to the customers. No wonder most people speak negatively of them.

GameStop has been selling a lot of other merchandise for sometime to try and keep up because selling games as their primary stock isn't keeping anyone afloat anymore. They've got board games, plushes, mugs, etc. etc. now.

Yeah, the last time I went to a GameStop they had a lot of Funko Pops on display, which is what many stores have I think (esp for the "exclusive" pops for individual stores), which is one of the ways to gain business since those are quite popular particularly for collectors. This is a way to regain a certain kind of business if nobody is coming in, and that's probably why ThinkGeek has now merged with them in this way to maintain their online business. But really, even though ThinkGeek was overpriced and constantly out-of-stock of things and took forever to restock them, at least they were much, much better than GameStop.

They couldn't even get their porn ban right because everyone posting food, dogs, family photos, etc are getting flagged while porn bots are going strong.

It was bullshit when they did the whole "female-presenting nipple" nonsense and basically mocked people for complaining about the sexist wording of it. Like yeah, we know that you claim you want to be "family friendly" but it's just so you can get the site back into the app store to make money. Which now y'all lost money because you drove people away from this ridiculous ban that screwed everyone over, including people who weren't even posting anything explicit at all. Just, an utter fail on every level.

[impala-chick.livejournal.com]

The Tumblr news is quite crazy. I wonder what Wordpress intends to do with it.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

That's what many are wondering, as well. Considering how badly Yahoo/Verizon completely fucked things up, the expectations are pretty damn low.

[impala-chick.livejournal.com]

True. As long as the site doesn't completely implode I probably wouldn't complain, considering what's been going on.

[perpetual.livejournal.com]

Aw man. I hadn't heard about ThinkGeek until now. What a shame, especially missing the clearances.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

It's pretty disheartening. I'm sad that I didn't know when the clearance was happening either, because there were things I had eyed for some time that I would've gotten a chance to finally get. I'm sure I can probably find them elsewhere, but still. It would've been the only time I could have bought them for cheap on ThinkGeek, lol.

[perpetual.livejournal.com]

Same, word for word. I'm also just going to miss shopping on that site. Loved always seeing the new stuff they came up with, even if I didn't want to buy it.

[honeymink]

I deleted my tumblr a while ago out of anger (and am only sorry that I didn't save a few artworks). But like somebody else already mentioned... the whole nipple/porn-ban failure? I had made screencap collages of 'Reign' for while... and a lot of them got flagged just because I assume I used filters that ultimately made the picture more peach/rose tinted, so the algorithm must have flagged them as fleshtoned = nudity. Then you can ask for an inquest to have the flag removed and I did so. Yes, that removed the flag from the single entries but my tumblr as a whole still had a flag on it for possible inappropriate/sexual content. What's up with that? I was done.

[rogueslayer452.livejournal.com]

Their algorithm is such a flawed, broken system that was implemented to basically flag anything that was viewed inappropriate, even if it actually isn't. It's selective nature is dangerous and has gotten many innocent posts and blogs flagged for no reason. What's ironic is aside from the invasive porn bots that everyone wanted gone and begged the staff to do something about to no avail, this wasn't really an issue for years until Yahoo/Verizon realized they couldn't make a profit where "explicit content" existed, so they censored things (aka changing things they promised not to change), only for it to backfire immensely. Like censorship always does. Keep in mind this ban was done at the end of last year, and then now Yahoo/Verizon ending up losing a lot of money in a quick amount of time and sold it only months after that. But still, the damage was done for many people and with good reason. Plus, the whole "female-presenting nipples" explanation is just absolutely sexist on every level, that even they mocked people criticizing that aspect, which was nagl.

I want to hope that under new ownership that this ban will be lifted, but from what I've read so far there's no plans on doing that. :/